A few truths: Professional doesn’t mean high quality and part time doesn’t mean poor quality. There is no correlation whatsoever. I see a good cross section of the industry as a trainer and there are good and bad photographers on both sides of the fence. There are uninsured professionals that churn out rubbish and there are expert amateurs making fine wedding albums. I agree with several of my Twitter followers that the term ‘weekend warrior’ is derogatory so I will use ‘second income shooter’ instead.
The perceived problem: Some full time professional photographers have a problem charging enough for their work to make living. Contrary to popular belief this problem is not the fault of second income shooters. As far as I can remember there have always been photographers who have had a regular job during the week and then shoot a wedding or two at the weekend. There have always been ‘Uncle Bobs’ prepared to do the job for free too. I started out as a second income shooter when I was at the BBC and so did many of the top professionals I know. It was, and still is, the sensible way for many to start out.
Market led prices: Market forces will always determine a fair price for the quality of photography on offer. The current oversupply in the middle and lower sectors of our industry has forced prices down. Acceptably good ‘pictures on disc’ photography packages can now be bought for around £1000. There is also a lot of rubbish on offer at this price point but those photographers offering inferior pictures or a poor customer experience will be less successful at getting clients unless they are expert marketeers. Brides do shop around.
Hobbyists are growing in number: Photography as a hobby is booming and nearly everyone it seems, now owns a good camera. There is an ever growing number of amateur photographers who want to start earning money from their cameras.
Amateurs have got good: It has become really difficult to take pictures that are significantly better than those that a keen amateur can take. Five or ten years ago when digital cameras were more expensive and kit lenses poorer in quality the pro-am gap was wide. Good DSLRs are cheap, easy to use and free to practice with.
Quality drop is market led: A growing number of the public no longer demand a high technical quality in photography. Just like the death of HiFi caused by the MP3 revolution, the photographic print has largely been replaced by the Facebook ready Jpeg taken on a smart phone. A young couple today don’t have a shoe box full of prints. Life has moved on since the turn of the century.
High quality still pays: The very best wedding photographers still earn a good living. So do the good second income photographers that hold on to all or part of their day job while photographing weddings at the weekend. Becoming a part time wedding photographer is often the wise choice in order to pay the bills and feed the family.
My advice to the full time professional: Be amazing, take fabulous pictures and deliver them in albums way beyond the scope of the amateur. Be the Jimmy Choo, or the Jaguar and charge a decent amount of money for a superb product. Be great at business. You will most likely spend 6 days working in your business for every 1 that you spend shooting weddings. Become a marketing expert and create an army of raving fans. They will be loyal and recommend you to their friends. Don’t blame others, stay positive and take responsibility for your actions. Embrace change and be creative.
My advice to the newcomer: Rise above the grumbles from disgruntled professionals. Get trained, do a great job, serve your customers well and enjoy your photography. If switching to part time is an option then consider that, but think carefully before giving up your job. Keep a steady income until you can charge enough for your wedding photography to replace it. Wedding photography can pay quite well but often not amazingly well, and certainly no more than it did five to ten years ago.
Damien Lovegrove.
Have your say using the comments section below. Please understand that this is a private blog and not an open forum.
Very good article and that puts a good perspective on things. I have gone for training and mentoring and I am currently shooting weddings as part of my mentoring program. I am in fact paying to get the opportunity glad in the knowledge that the day I second shoot or shoot wedding solo I will be able to create and deliver great images. I think that there should be a minimum training requirement like in other industries both for the re-assurance of clients and established photographers.
Hi Alexis,
Thanks for your considered response. I commend you on taking a moral and practical route to fulfilling the demands of your prospective clients. I just wish our industry was as conciensious as you. I wish you every success. Kindest regards and respect, Damien.
Hi, Whenever I read articles along these lines my mind goes back to 1980 when I was working on a local newspaper as a young press photographer. I had 4 other colleagues and in addition to being staff photographers on the paper we all shot a lot of work privately.
The local studio chappy once came into see the editor and “reported” us for doing private work as he claimed it should be his by right and we were stealing his work!
So its not a new thing, this full / part time argument has been going on for decades.
I totally agree with the message I read you are trying to put over Damien
Damien, thank you for your great article. Experience results in better pictures and better pictures will sell. I bought your DVD “The Big Day” a few days ago. Everybody can see how pros like you and your wife work and care for their clients – to create a good experience for your clients is important. Thank you for sharing your passion and knowledge!
Thanks Franky :)
Great well balanced article. A great read.
Second income is where I am at Damien.
Its the fault of the Facebook world that has devalued the image makers not just second income shooters.
I strive to provide a professional service and always charge the right amount and always always tell my bride and groom that its not my main income – they always on seeing the slideshow say that it should be!
A nicely written piece though!
The cream will always come to the top!
Great article Damien! In my opinion he who is the best marketer and business man wins. I see so many amatures with exelent imagery and I see pros with competent imagery. It goes both ways.
Thank you all for the support and inteligent contributions for this controvertial topic. I’ve said my bit so I won’t be replying to all your comments individually. They are mostly eloquent, relevent and complete.
Damien.
Completely agree with the article.
Being a ‘second Income Shooter’, its annoying to hear pro’s knock you down because you are starting out and offering a cheaper product. But many of us are serious about what we do, aspire to improve and charge what we think is a fair price for what we do.
However, like Damien, there are alot of pro’s that are free with advise to help those that want to improve and maintain a quality level on photography.
Very true that the game has to be raised as many guests at weddings have DSLR’s and watch you do your stuff.
A friend ours works for Apple, and they seem to be worlds apart from competitors, not only with product, but they way they treat customers, eg waiving repair fees, offering free tips instore, actively encouraging customer to try products and having great knowledge of products. You will probably find it hard to get that from a regular mobile phone or electrical store!!
We need to set ourselves apart with the quality of our work! Pro’s that put down new starters need to take this approach I feel!
Great article Damien. When I started out with wedding photography, I did it properly by paying for and doing all the right training and getting the right qualifications before establishing my own brand of wedding photography – so I have actually already done exactly what you advised! I’ve got some great feedback from my customers and I certainly do enjoy my photography!
I figure the wedding photography industry is a little like the housing marketing. Those properties that are a little shabby and not up together are going to struggle to sell and have to alter their price accordingly. Those properties that are top notch and up together will hold their price and ultimately sell. I don’t believe the 2nd income shooter is the issue. Moral of the story get up together!
I actually wrote a blog post awhile back called “How Amateurs are (not) ruining the photo market” that makes many of these points. I think you’re spot on with your analysis and advice to professionals
:)
Good Job!
Superb article as usual Damien.
I am more concerned about those out there who are offering photography/business/seo training to newbies when they deliver little of substance.
There’s a lot of money being made (un-ethically) from naive wannabe photographers and many magazines also perpetuate the myth that a good dslr is a license to print money.
You are on of the few who doesn’t worship at the feet of Mammon and for that you will always have my respect and gratitude.
Keep it up!
I feel so chuffed that I contributed a little on twitter :)
Cumulatively you have collated together all the possible points involved and done a really good job of organising and anylising it.
Business is business and quality of service is paramount and helps to serve itself :)
I also like the bit in the advice to pros “don’t blame others” something you see all the time on forums.
Might I add by saying though,
Don’t blame others, don’t blame yourself address what is wrong and move on. That is professional.
Now, back to my part time business and getting them clients!
I fully agree with your comments, Damien. I shoot weddings for a second income. I prefer to think of myself as semi-pro and constantly strive to deliver high quality photos and albums to my wedding couples – there’s nothing more satisfying than hearing a high pitched scream of delight from a bride as she opens the first page of her album! Your training DVDs have been so beneficial to me.
What a great article. I am what one would call a “second income shooter” and I will remain a second income shooter until I retire. Why would I do this…BENEFITS. There are members of my family with extremely expensive medical concerns and if I didn’t have benefits we would be sunk. So, I keep my full time job and shoot according to what my schedule will allow…I have blocks of time available and will not fit a client in if that time is booked…I will at that point suggest photographers that may met their needs. I always bristle when people called me a “weekend warrior” and think of me as the reason they as “professionals” aren’t making any money. Many of those that I have personally met, with the “it’s your fault I am not making any money mentality”; aren’t making money because of their attitude or the way they come across to the client or potential client. I go to many of the area bridal, mommy shows and many of the local festivals (not as an exhibitor)….much of the time you see the same photographers at these shows or festivals (and a few new ones) and let me tell you those that ARE making money are those who know how to market themselves and make everyone love them. Once clients feel comfortable with the photographer; from this “cut” you will then find the style and budget tiers; the very best photographers with a unique style command the highest price, good photographers with various styles that match what the client is looking for are able to obtain the next price tier, adequate photographers with traditional photos the next price level etc etc right down to those with a camera and because of this they are a photographer. Then there are the photographers that fall into the same “tiers” from excellent to horrible BUT have no idea how to market themselves and come across as pompous, conceited and unwilling to work with the client to acheive the client’s vision….these are the guys that aren’t making money and blaming the “second income shooters”. It really doesn’t matter how good they are….potential clients after speaking to them for a few minutes at these shows don’t like them and won’t be calling them. Don’t believe this statement well, hang out at these shows and stand just out of hearing distance of the photographer’s booth and listen to the comments of the potential client…you may be very surprised. Believe also that those “impressions” are being discussed to everyone the potential client knows. Then go and talk to the photographer and judge for yourself how well they market themselves…then look at their work. Just as importantly, give the consumer a bit of credit as well. Different clients have different needs or criteria…and they will look for a photographer that they feel comfortable with, have a portfolio that best matches what they are looking for and have the price and availabilty that match their needs…I don’t think the consumer cares if you are the “professional” or the “second income shooter”. The price of the photography service isn’t really determined by which category the photograher falls into; unless it is a new photographer trying to break into the business and build a portfolio….then, they are almost giving it away and the client is usually well aware of this and the risk involved. The photos may be absolutely stunning or absolutely horrid but, the clients liked the price and weren’t too concerned at the time about the risk. Once these photos are received, the tears may be joyful or tears of dissapointment. My opinion of this type of almost giving it away is….all photograhers did this in the beginning when trying to build a portfolio and none of us “professional” or “second income shooters” kept these give away prices for long…..unless you don’t know how to market yourself or are having trouble getting jobs because your portfolio is laking in quality.
Top read Damien.
As someone who’s just starting out your advice for newcomers is just what I needed. The discussions in the comments are great also. I’ve learnt a lot from just this one post. Thanks :)
Theres some really good points in the text. “market leads the prices” passage is spot on and that creates one of the biggest problems. The sheer number of amateurs offering cheap wedding photography creates a market where clients are not willing to spend more. Moreover a professional pays taxes, in my country about 50% goes into varying taxes. And charging 50% more is suicide for your business. Also not every professional can be “Jimmy Choo” no matter how good images and service they provide to their clients.
I think this is one of the best article i have read.I love sport photography and one day hope to be as good as the professionals i see.I know i can not match there skill for many years.I also get annoyed at there attitude sometimes most keen amateurs do not want put anyone out of a job they just want to do something they love for a living.I even had a chap email me and say my stuff was not good this hurt and made me more determined to be better than ever.
I’m one of these “weekend warriors” that accepted to do a family member’s wedding because she cried poverty but had no problem paying for fois gras. My photos sucked (thank god for Photoshop) as I knew they would compared to professions. Just because the tools are available to everyone doesn’t makes us “pros”. The music industry faces the same issues. Being a professional wedding photographer should be left to those who that nail it.
Next topic: My friend knows a guy that wants to become a wedding DJ…
Great article presented here. You have covered the subject oh so well. I might add being from the States, the economy has had as much of an impact upon the wedding industry photography included. Combined with low cost of proconsumer/professional gear and Photoshop/Lightroom, the ranks of photography has swollen to a near breaking point.
You are so right in pointing out that the successful photographer, professional or amateur, is based on how they do stand out from the crowd and their marketing savvy. I strive to be different, offer unique and wonderful albums etc., but then the slow economy has trimmed the number of weddings taking place and their budgets too.
One last thing I will add for those wanting to be great. Be consistent in your work quality, customer service rules, and have a blast doing your thing!
Ciao,
David Wright
That such an incredible way of putting it in perspective. I really appreciate that you took the time to write this and I plan on reading this over in the future to refresh the thoughts you are portraying into words.
Thank You,
Rob Leslie, Vancouver, BC
Good solid points and well put. Quality and Brand will always command the best fees. I worked with BMW for 30 years and learned from the car industry about marketing, quality, customer service etc. I’m now a freelance photographer (I don’t do weddings btw) but I know plenty who do. The good ones make a living thanks to their reputation , quality, marketing and expertise. Others pick up the scraps and either improve or disappear.
Good article Damien. The one point I feel I need to make is. The market is being crushed by people doing cheap or free photography.. thats the problem. If the part time photographer can command serious money for a shoot then fine. If they are working for peanuts then harm is being done. So long as tax is paid and vat is paid along with insurance let the images do the talking.
However it seems the tag of professional or a free tag line is worth more to many people than the revenue. I make all my income from photography and a good income at that. But at the same time how would the full time teacher making a few bob at weekends feel if I went into schools for free and took there work still enjoying a wonderful living from photography, just because I could? Not to happy I would guess…. So before you Lure my paying clients with free or cheap photography just stand back and think how you would like the tides turned on you?
So Part time is no problem. Cheap photography and free photography is…
Just on another note, a few weekends ago I was in Betty’s in Harrogate, a quite well known if not famous Coffee shop. I paid just short of £50 for 4 hot chocolate drinks and 4 sandwiches. WHY? I sat and wondered, then concluded that although the drinks and sandwiches were lovely, (I could have purchased a similar quality product for a quarter of the price else where), it was more than the actual product. It was the setting, beautiful rooms. It was the service, attentive staff dressed in old fashioned style black and white waiting uniforms. It was the experience itself. For the learning I took away from that visit to Betty’s I now consider that £50 well spent. I hope this makes sense to others.
I have a Soldier coming to see me today. He is leaving the Army next year and is thinking of getting into Wedding photography. He contacted me cold and I have agreed to chat to him and if possible try to help in any way I can. Why? In my few years shooting weddings the one thing I have learnt is that there is always someone out there for YOU! no matter how many others there are. While one couple can tell me I am too expensive, a second couple can tell me they can’t believe how reasonable my prices are. I find people booking weddings with me because of random things such as ‘We think you will be able to control our guests’ or ‘We think you are funny’. What has either of those things got to do with photography? My Mantra is that ‘There is always someone out there just for you’ It is just a matter of making sure they can find you. A saturated, changing, Wedding photography market is exciting. It is a level playing field, You all have something the next photographer doesn’t. Great discussion well received.
Hi Damien
Great blog and as ever you are not worried about being being controversial. As my recent letter published in Photo Professional stated it’s all about the image not the kit. i’ve seen you at workshops using any students camera with a decent lens producing incredible images albeit composed in beautiful light. This is the key to successful wedding photography: stunning composition in an incredible stressful situation. To my knowledge there are no great books on photographic composition so whether second income shooter or professional this is where many of them are struggling to sell “Quality, Added value or whatever other term they wish to us to increase their margins”. I can tell a quality image when I see one but that leads me into another area: that of perception. Does the average bride and her mother know a quality image when she sees one or is she just a FB afficianado – don’t I recall you saying Damien that you interviewed your clients to make sure there was a fit between their expectation and yours.
I am currently mentoring a graduate fashion photographer who travels to all her shots by public transport whilst hand carrying her trusty Canon, Speedlight, Chinese Poppers and a £5 shoot through umbrella. That’s dedication. She is starting off at ground level and working her butt off. Not a lot of technical expertise but a great eye for composition and hence stunning images. I’ve just recommended she tries weddings to fund her fashion ambitions! Sorry guys but there could be a great new kid on the block pretty soon who will eventually be a great photographer.
Hi Damien
As a ‘second income shooter’ working very hard to build up my brand and become full time this is so refreshing to see.
Thank you for such an honest appraisal.
Ivan
Interesting post Damien, In my experience, setting up a photography business takes a lot commitment determination and finance and now how. Buying a pro camera is just the start.
As most of us are aware the capitol investment into equipment is considerable, maybe not so much camera bodies but good quality lenses. If you striving to produce quality imagery you cannot produce it using the bottom of a milk bottle.
Business, Marketing, Post production, creativeness, people skills, require continual investment of your time, and time is money. Lastly a considered program of quality training is a must you cannot afford to stop learning.
Then getting started is the real challenge. you need examples of you work to present to potential clients so you need sample albums. I spent two years second shooting for several studios for free, just to gain experience and to build my portfolio.
Uncle bob may do someone a favour with his new digital SLR and this will always be the case. some people simply do not place photography as a priority on their wedding day, so therefore a budget photographer will suffice. Since mobile phones have been able to take pictures the general expectation of quality photography has diminished. Check out most of your friends photos on facebook mostly are very poor indeed, in my opinion as long as this is the case I will enjoy success with my photography business. Recently I decided to stop presenting my wedding photography in slide show format when meeting potential new clients. When I place a well designed wedding album into their hands they are blown away. Its just a case of which front cover do they want. Wedding album design skills, another must have. Sometimes we forget how hard it is to set up a photography business that will produce an income. There are lots of photographers who enter the business but there is also a lot that leave. Quality work will always sell. Clients who just want some photographs taken at their wedding and are not to concerned about quality are looking for a bargain, so they buy on price. However people who appreciate and want quality work and are willing pay for it do so, but they also want something extra, Value.
Amateur derived from the Latin word amator meaning lover. A person who does something for the love doing something.
Pro on the other hand is someone who stands on the corner of the street prostituing themselves for money.
I’m proudly a half way house of an amateur who accepts money ;-)
Customers know there is always someone cheaper and in general price relates to the quality, service and presentation irrelevant of whether ‘second income’ or not.
However, I believe that for those wanting more than budget, customer perception of what is ‘professional’ is very important. Perceived value is vital and their willingness to pay ‘proper’ money is diminished by A, the idea that you aren’t pro because you’re not full time and B, that you don’t need to charge what you do as you already have a job – so shouldn’t!
It all boils down to quality of service and product backed up by corporate image and sales ability and wedding photography isn’t in an exclusive club – that’s business!
well articulated piece D.
Disappointed no reference to photo vests, or taking every piece of kit to Focus on the off chance you might get to shoot a model from 50m :) Maybe your follow up article should be idiosyncrasies of photography.
See you soon Bud
C
Thank you for the interesting read Damien. I think there’s a marked difference between “professional” and “full time”. To me being a professional is all about customer service, a focus on always doing the best for your clients and constant self improvement, not just about the number of hours you work. If you’re a “professional” full timer, you have nothing to fear from people picking up the lower end of the market. Like you said above “be amazing”, should be part of any professional’s mindset. If you’re a “professional” part timer then your half way there already, and don’t need to listen to unprofessional full timers moaning. There will always be a place for both in any industry not just wedding photography.
Hi Damien,
Really pleased you opened this discussion, I am a weekend warrior, I charge a small amount for my services and my clients get great value for their money,I train hard, I go on courses with top professionals, as my experience grows so will my rates. I can not see a problem with this, if the top proffesionals are against the weekend warrior why are so many of them offering training courses, the people they are taking money from are mostly weekend warriors!! Love prophotonut full of great advice.
Nice to see someone write in a balanced way on this subject.
Your advice for the newcomer is very good, and this quote ‘Keep a steady income until you can charge enough for your wedding photography to replace it’ rings some bells for me, in fact a large part of my business plan is to develop other areas of my photography business to deliver steady income along side weddings.
This is an issue I always think is over looked by people making the argument against the ‘second income photographers’ – what if a Commercial, School or Press Photographer happens to have a sideline photographing weddings at the weekend (as a second income stream) – they are no doubt a professional photographer- just not a full time wedding photographer. What would the feelings of the ‘anti weekend shooters’ in this instance?
My opinion is as yours, there is room for both types of photographer in the market, and the person that deserves the bookings is the one the markets the best, gives the best customer service and has their price right for their targeted customer. (Taking good photos should be a given)
Great article in Photo Professional and post as usual Damien. Both sides covered.
Changes are to be expected in all professions, ‘second income shooter’ are no different than in any other professions.
Provide a great service and customer satisfaction both Pro and SIS with great images and you will be busy. Provide what Uncle Bob can do and you won’t. Or not for very long anyway.
Cheers Damien
Excellent post!
Damien, this is an excellent, well constructed and balanced post addressing the misconceptions of the never ending debate. Pros will always whinge that part time togs are stealing their income, the answer is to up your game as you rightly say.
Fortunately it doesn’t affect me because I don’t shoot weddings anymore. When I did it was easy to tell the pros from the rest – we used Hasselblad or Rollei medium format camera gear, something the Uncle Bob’s couldn’t afford. Today it’s more difficult, as you say, anyone can buy a half decent DSLR for a few hundred and set themselves up as a wedding tog.
For those of us outside the major cities commercial day rates are a challenge, you won’t find too many weekend warriors signing up to shoot incontinence products as I was recently. In days gone by I used a 5×4 Toyo with sheet film – slower, methodical but so satisfying to work with. Those days are gone we have to accept the challenge and move on. Years of experience still count, being able to see an image is still the most valuable skill we posses.
Excellent, well balanced post
Nicely put Damien, if your good enough you’ll get work. I have 3 incomes (one is a forces pension), so what. Ive been invited by a high class hotel to be one of three official/recommend photographers after they saw us working and the quality of our work at a single wedding. I train hard and work hard in both of my jobs. There will always be a bottom end market and people will fill it, and thats in all walks of life.
Hi
In reply to sams question.
Try the Guild of photographers. I have been with them for 3 months and with there help it has transformed my business. they have got it all. I was a member of another pro org, but got nothing from it they were only interested in my money.
http://www.photoguild.co.uk
You will be glad you did.
Pete
A great read, I’m starting out & I do feel I’m stepping on toes but hopefully my photos will prove I can eventually make it as a respected full time pro.
An honest appraisal as always. As with other areas of the industry, there is nothing to be gained by throwing our hands in the air and complaining “but we are PROFESSIONALS”. We have to draw on the resources that we have, both as creatives and as experienced shooters, to produce the best experience possible for our clients.
I agree with what you say. I see no point in moaning and spreading negativity just because the market is tough. The answer, I think, is never to be satisfied with your work – be happy with it, but know that you can always be better – and this attitude in itself will set you apart and drive you to improve all aspects of your business. Well, this is my plan at least and one day I intend to be good enough and known enough to charge top money so that I’m not competing in the somewhat saturated end of the market.
The funny thing is there will always be a market for both sides. The facebook photographer will generally get the low budget jobs whilst the established photographer will attract the higher demographic.
We recently had to find a photographer for our own wedding and being in the same industry made it very hard. We saw a wide range from second income photographers to graduate photographers to full time professionals, all with great imagery. What was interesting though was some of the second income photographers had put more into their marketing than the full time professionals.
I totally agree with you Damien full timers need to create a distinct difference and by no means try to accommodat for the lower end. It devalues their hard work and will only send them backwards. I’m a full timer in a different sector and have spoken with other more established photographers that are very negative because “anyone can pick up a camera and think they are a photographer” but we all know it’s not as simple as that yet they still let it get to them.
Wonderful post. A picture is worth than thousands words. Photography is indeed the best way to express your feelings and depicts the era. I love photography and look over the web for finding useful stuff for the same. I came across your blog and after subscribing in my feeder I hope you will keep on the good posts like this continuously. Thanks You
Well balanced article showing both sides of the argument. I’m sitting right on the fence because I would love to be a pro but
A) I’m not good enough yet, even though most say I am and
B) I don’t have the equipment.
I’ll leave weddings to the pros and make some money as a landscape/sports photographer.
That’s a very fair assessment I think, especially regarding client expectations about picture quality / what they do with the pictures. It just means we have to work harder in educating the market as to what the possibilities are beyond on-line galleries and Facebook.
Agree {Especially with: ‘Advice to the newcomer’). I believe there is a perception that buying a camera and investing some emotional time qualifies somebody to consider giving up a steady income. I once heard the quote: “Grow Slow, Grow Strong”, I think this applies nicely to Wedding Photography. A nice Post!
Interesting article Damien. It’s nice to see this topic being given a considered and thoughtful examination. This is often something that divides opinion and this article treads the middle ground well. Things are rarely black and white.
I would’ve been interested to hear where you think the role of some of the professional organisations stands. As a relative newcomer it’s not been clear to me the worth or benefit of many of them, save to give some photographers a discount on insurance etc.
Cheers.
A good article which covers both sides evenly. Makes a change!